quandered in the moft improvident manner. What would the intended fubfcription of 500l. do to ftop fuch flood-gates? He withed to ask what we now were fighting for? Was it Belgium? If folet the country be asked if they would perfevere in the war for fuch an object. Was it for any territorial poffeffion? Had the French infulted us? If they had, he would be one, and he was affured the nation unanimously would unite in obtaining reparation. Lord Grenville again arofe: he obferved that of late minifters had declined fending troops to the continent: they had turned all their attention to the navy and colonies; and though they had been fo fuccefsful, ftill they were blamed. The noble marquis had affirmed, that it was not a change of men but of meafures which was defirable: to which he replied, that any change in our government would throw the country into immediate confu. fion. Had not minifters preferved it from French principles, and was this a small advantage? But why was the war carried on? It vs not for this or that province; it was, whether the French fhould poffefs the whole of the maritime coaft of the continent; another reafon was, the haughty manner in which they had rejected our overtures for peace. No minifter had ever been more ignominiously treated than ours. Profeffions of unanimity had often been heard in-that houfe, if the country were to be infulted; but they never were made good, when the occasion occurred. His lordship ended with condemning the language of defpondence, and vaunting the abundance of our refources. The marquis of Lanfdowne anfwered, that it was not extraordi nary that the French fhould have fhown fome haughtiness: they could not but remember the opprobrious terms used towards them by our minifters, and it was probable they would refent it. He denied having recommended a change of government; he only defired the prefent fhould be changed into a conftitutional fyftem, and he would contend for this point, though he was well aware it had been the custom for minifters to infinuate that those who recommended it were Jacobins. He reprobated Jacobin principles, because he was convinced they went to a community of goods, and other abfurd and pernicious doctrines, even beyond the agrarian law. He did not believe there were many of fuch principles in England, and he knew of no fuch practical Jacobins as his majesty's minifters; they had banished gold and filver from London at the time they be gan to be plenty in Paris; they had taken up the paper fyftem at the time France had laid it down. Forced loans, military force, and every Jacobin project had been adopted here, as France had rejected them. The immortal jury of 1794 had fufficiently expofed the falflood of Jacobin pretended plots. To the noble conduct of that jury he did not know how many of their lordships were now indebted for their lives and fortunes; it was that jury which defeated the Robefpierrian fyftem, attempted to be eftablished in this country by the minifters. The duke of Bedford profeffedly wifhed, he faid, both for a change of minifters, of the fyftem on which government had been conducted, and, he might fay, for the reftora. tion of the conftitution. His grace quoted the papers on the table, to how the concealment minifters had made made of the public expences to enable them to profecute the war, He asked if the way to deftroy French principles, was to ruin the country? He did not think they were fo fafcinating as to be dreaded. The reafon peace was not reftored, truly was because it could not be made but on terms difgrace. ful to thofe minifters who had held fuch lofty language during the war. His grace then took a view of the enorious taxes, and ftrenuoufly fupported the motion. For it 16-Against it 86. May 19th, alderman Combe rofe to make his promifed motion for the difmiffal of his majesty's minifters. He prefaced his fpeech with great diflidence, and with a deep confcioufnefs of inability undertook the difcuffion of fo important a fubject. principle by which their governor It was, he faid, the general opinion of the people of this country, as well as that of his conftituents, that the calamities which preffed fo hard upon the people were in a great meafure, if not wholly, owing to the minifters having plunged us into the prefent war. He would not deny that at the commencement it appeared to be popular, but it long had ceafed to be so, and nothing had fo contributed to produce this effect as the incapacity of those who had carried it on. By minifters it had been declared to be both juft and neceffary; in both thefe points he had always differed from them, but, even allowing that it was fo, it was reafonable to expect that the public fhould have been informed of the real or ofterfible ground on which it had been entered into; and furely in a contest between two great nations nothing lefs could have been expected. In vain, however, had the people fought for fome fixed and fettled. his conftituents that they were not: it required men of greater minds and more upright intentions to bring about this object. He would take up no more of the time of the houfe than by moving "that an addrefs be prefented to his majefty, befeeching him to difmifs from his councils his prefent minifters, as the moft likely means of obtaining a permanent and speedy peace." Sir William Milner said, that in feconding this motion he followed the opinion of his conftituents, and, though he defpaired of its fuccefs, he was convinced, that if the fenfe of the people were to be taken upon the fubject, the minifters would no longer continue to heap diftreffes upon the country. Mr. I. H. Browne oppofed the motion in a fpeech of confiderable length, in the course of which he took a view of the whole conduct of administration for the last twelve years, and declared he approved of their measures. The gentlemen who had fpoken had both of them declared they thought themfelves bound to follow the inftructions of their conftituents; and as the reprefentatives of the two first cities in the kingdom, their opinions were certainly entitled to the higheft refpect. He had, for his own part, the honour to reprefent a very populous place; his conftituents' confifted of about two thousand; in returning him their reprefentative, they had enabled him to act for them to the best of his judgment: If his conftituents chofe to inftruct him, he should follow his own judgment if he differed from them in opinion; and if they were difpleafed at this, they might reject bim at the next general election. He therefore diffented altogether from the worthy alderman and the hoLourable baronet on the fubject of obeying the inftructions of his con ftituents. He looked upon himfelf as really an independent man, and had neither received nor folicited any favour from minifters. With regard to the prefent adminiftration, he thought the country owed every thing to them: the three greatest bleflings which could be poffeffed, liberty, internal tranquillity, and general profperity! He firft enumerated the liberties --- · that juries had been invefted with the right which had been difputed, of judging of all the circumftances of the cafe, in point of law as well as fact: it was under the aufpices of the prefent adminiftration, and against very high and powerful authority; that the continuance of an impeachment had been carried. It was under the fame adminiftration that the bill fo obnoxious to the people of Canada had been repealed, and a fyftem of freedom established in its ftead. Even the abuses of liberty had been touched with a lenient hand, and the bill' for preventing and punishing fedition had been limited to the term of two years. Mr. Browne dwelt upon the inftances of what he called lenity, and then proceeded to notice the fecond point, tranquillity, which, he faid, were fo clear from the excellent meafures "which had been adopted, that it was unnecessary to go farther into the fubject. He then came to the third, the general profperity of the country. In the year 1784 the prefent minifter came into office; and from that time to 1792 no country had ever flourished more. By means of his fi nancial abilities he raised the funds, which he found at 64, during the courfe of that period to 98. In the fame proportion with the funds the trade, manufactures, agricul0-3 ture thought his majesty needed not the advice of their lordships to entertain a tender regard for the interefts of his fubjects, and therefore diffented from the motion. The marquis of Landfdowne admitted there had been confiderable improvements in the regulation of the internal affairs of Ireland. The having ten feffions in the year, in ftead of four, for the trial of offençes he looked upon as a great good. Murders had been too fre., quently committed in that country, and the bringing to juftice the perpetrators of fuch horrid acts was the duty of the executive government; and it was alfo the dus ty of every individual to fupport government in that refpect. He had heard it faid, " property was the creature of law :" this was fo far from true, that law was rather the creature of property. He faw the neceffity of doing much in favour of the poor people of Ireland. It was a fact well known that there was a great quantity of land which produced nothing there, but which might be productive of much; and that there was a great number of people who had nothing to do, who might be well employed in the cultivation of thefe lands. He fhould be glad to join in any plan, either in or out of parliament, for public utility Perhaps it might be promoted by dividing a large eftate into feparate properties: he had written abroad with a view to fome scheme of this kind; but it ought to be voluntary, for he had no idea of force in the diftribution or management of any man's property-nor indeed could any benefit accrue to the lower claffes of fociety, till an end was put to this difaftrous war. The earl of Darnley obferved, the motion evidently pointed to the emancipation of the catholics, as the means of ending difcontents. He oppofed it upon the grounds that the fituation of Ireland did not call for it, for there never was a time when all defcriptions of men were fo well fatisfied with adminiftration as at prefent. Discontents there might be among a certain defcription of people, but by no means amongst the general mafs of the people on whose behalf the popular cry of catholic emancipation was fuppofed to have been raised, though in fact it was made ufe of for a very different purpose by perfons who had no intereft in the caufe of the catholics, but as it ferved to cover the designs of fubverting the government. The difcontented were not the poor catholics of the South, who had shown fuch attachment to their country, but the rich inhabitants of the North, who had ma, nifefted a very different fpirit. Befides the great body of the Irish cas tholics, the lower orders of the community never could be inte. refted in the queftion, having received every indulgence. For these reafons he gave his negative, The duke of Bedford confeffcd,. that, but for the affurance which the noble lord had given, it would have been to him a matter of wonder that the catholics were contented, because it was extraordinary that they fhould be fo, when profcribed all benefits of the ftate under wuich they lived, where they were marked with difgrace, and put entirely into the hands of the executive government. But it feemed they gave an instance of their attachment to government in the late threatened invasion; was this the proof that was to be given as a reafon that their complaints hould to them the man whom they have tried, and whom they admire: act on the principles on which he acted, and difcontents will ceafe. If you do not, heaven only knows what dreadful confequences await you." Lord Grenville, evidently exafperated at the remarks of his grace, rofe (he faid) chiefly for the pur pofe of doing away the impreffion they might leave:" he was far from endeavouring to fhield himself behind the virtues of the fovereign's he only paid his majefty that tri bute which all the world knew to be his due: he afcribed no part of that merit to himself, or to any ad miniftration. He had faid, and he contended for the truth of it, that the intereft of the people of Ireland had invariably been a princi pal object with the executive go vernment of this country. The noble duke propofed to do the very thing which he feemed to dread, namely, to create a disturbance in Ireland; for that must necellarily be the tendency of recalling the prefent lord Hentenant of that kingdom. If his talents, virtues, and exertions could not preferve tranquillity, he believed it would be out of the power of any individual whatever.. hould be paffed without notice? Had we fhewn any inclination to reward this generous attachment? Quite the contrary! He had often obferved the conduct of minifters in all public affairs; he had feen how they evaded all questions which could lead to difcuffions' bearing hard upon themfelves. But of all their attempts to fcreen themfelves the prefent was the weakeft: they had not used one argument; they had only made a few affertions, and pretended to found them on the principles of our conftitution. The fecretary of ftate had endeavoured to protect himself hy a fhield which was in itself impenetrable, but which the fecretary was not entitled to ufe. He meant the facred character of the fovereign upon the throne. There exifted not one perfon more difpofed than Limfelf to pay all due reverence to that: but although he knew he was treading on delicate ground, yet he must perform his public duty. Many of thofe acts which had the fovereign's name to fanction them, ought to be confidered as the acts of minifters who advised them, and were called fo in the language of common fenfe. It was to this fource we might trace the diftreffes we had fuftained; to this was owing the lofs of thirteen flourishing colonies, the difafter of the prefent national bankruptcy, and thofe difcontents in Ireland which it was the object of the motion to remove. There was a character in that house, well known to their lordships, and to both countries, of whom he could fay much in commendation (though no praife could exalt him)were he not prefent. To minifters, however, he would offer this advice: Reftore to the Irish the perfon you have recalled; give back The duke of Bedford in return accufed the noble fecretary of mif reprefentation. He faid, he had anfwered his remarks, as if he had called upon the house to addrefs his majefty to recall the present lord 'lieutenant; he had done no fuch thing. He profeffed as high a veneration for the fovereign and his character as any lord could feel, but he must add, that, not withstanding all his own good acts and good intentions, his ministers had contrived to counteract theif fo effectually, that England was in a N 3 ftate |